This interview was originally featured on the Chapters.ca
site in September 2000.
Chapters.ca's Rae Ann Fera had the opportunity to speak with
MacLean's film critic and author of Brave Films, Wild Nights
about 25 years of Toronto International Film Festival history.
IN THE BEGINNGING...
Chapters.ca: Can you talk a little bit about
the resistance the festival met from the Toronto media in the
beginning?
Brian D. Johnson: I think it's very Canadian,
that sort of scepticism. If you look at Toronto before the festival
and Toronto after the festival there are lots of reasons to believe
that the festival couldn't happen here. The festival was sort of a
civilizing influence; it's turned Toronto into a cosmopolitan
city.
Conversely, before the festival started, Toronto was quite
parochial in a lot of ways and I don't think people had the vision
to imagine that we could have a major film festival in the city. I
think they were sceptical because of the bluster of the
organizers.
Also, a lot of the promises didn't pay off that first year. Bill
Marshall promised to deliver Jack
Nicholson, Julie
Christie, Robert
Towne . . . none of these people showed
up.
Chapters.ca: How has that relationship changed
now?
Johnson: Well, now the media has a complete
love affair with the film festival. The festival can do no
wrong.
I think the media realizes that the festival is the best thing
that ever happened to it in terms of arts and entertainment in this
city. Also, I think the festival has been very savvy of the media.
One of the reasons the festival succeeded so well right from the
beginning is because it cultivated the media. Marshall and Dusty
Cohl knew that the media were the key to success.
Chapters.ca: How did you think mainstream
success has affected the film festival?
Johnson: I think it's a mixed blessing. It's a
deal with the devil. Most people who have been around the festival
for a while are nostalgic about the days when the festival was
smaller, when you could see the buzz travel through the festival.
It's harder to do that now. I think of it sort of like trying to
pick out stars in the night sky in a city when it's full of light.
It's much harder to make discoveries now that you made before.
There is just so much going on.
On the hand, what are you going to do? Are you going to say,
"sorry, we don't want Robert
DeNiro, we don't want Tom
Cruise?" I think we just have to be very
careful that we don't let Hollywood run away with the festival.
Chapters.ca: You refer to Hollywood as the
"Hollywood Machine" in the book. How do you think this machine has
affected the development of Canadian film in general?
Johnson: Well, I don't think it's had an affect
one way or the other. You could say it's affected it in the sense
that the Hollywood machine fuels the festival, and the festival
tends to promote Canadian film. It uses this big gala stage as a
way of throwing the spotlight on Canadian film -- particularly on
opening night, where one Canadian film gets to play queen for a
night. But those are really the two opposite worlds.
I think the festival has different cultures within it. The
people who like to go to the galas are not the same people who like
to go to strange Japanese movies. The odd thing about the festival
is that you can't get in to Canadian films half the time. It's a
really hot ticket, Perspective Canada. The festival goes out and
courts Hollywood and then goes and showcases Canadian film.
CENSORSHIP, IDENTITY AND CANADIAN CINEMA
Chapters.ca: You touched on the issue of
censorship a moment ago. One of the biggest obstacles the festival
faced in the early years was the Ontario Censor Board. What changed
over the years that made them back off?
Johnson: I think they basically wore the Censor
Board down. It was a lot of work for the Censor Board because all
of a sudden in the fall they had 300 films screening over 10 days.
The Board had to look at every damn one of them. So after a while
the Censor Board decided to go to a documentation system, where
they would look at press notes and summaries of films and decide
which ones they wanted to see. And now it's got to the point
there's not really any censorship at all.
Chapters.ca: One of the stories I found
extraordinary was the case of In Praise of Older
Women, where they had both the censored and
uncensored reels in the projection booth. And festival film
reviewer Martin Heath just revealed in the book that the uncensored
reel was in fact shown. It took so many years for the truth of that
screening to come out, which begs the question, are we still afraid
of censorship?
Johnson: Well, if anybody had tried to get this
out of Martin earlier, my guess is that he wouldn't have told them.
Martin is very secretive. Well, secretive is not fair . . . Martin
lives in his own little underground. Martin acts as if he's part of
strange guerrilla movement or would like to think that perhaps
there is still some danger in that secret. But you know you are
breaking the law by interfering with the Board like that. And I
think the penalties are quite considerable, so these people were
quite scared of what they were doing.
Censorship was a double-edged sword. It created a lot of buzz
around these films; it was great for the local media and the local
profile of the festival. On the other hand it was quite
embarrassing for the festival because a lot of the films [being
censored] were not Canadian films they were international films.
It's very embarrassing to have filmmakers come in from around the
world into this one-horse town where someone decides their film
can't be shown.
Chapters.ca: At one point in the book you
mentioned that English-Canadian film suffered a lack of identity.
Has the festival helped Canadian film develop it's own
identity?
Johnson: It's just helped Canadian film,
period. If you look at English-Canadian film as we know it now,
with a few exceptions like Goin Down the
Road, there was no Canadian cinema. The festival
helped develop a group identity.
Also the festival provided a sort of goal. Getting a film into
the festival was like heaven. It's like being discovered by
Hollywood, locally speaking. Atom
Egoyan still looks back at his first feature
accepted. In fact, he's still got the voicemail tape on which the
programmer called and told him his film had been accepted.
The festival community was just that, a community. And if you
think of the Canadian film community, what it is , where does it
meet, what is it physically? Well, the festival gives a physical
manifestation to that community for 10 days. So I think the
festival provides a hothouse environment for English-Canadian
films.
Chapters.ca: Has Canadian cinema been
successful in its growth in breaking the stranglehold from American
film? Is it going to?
Johnson: No, I don't think it's going to. And
also, I don't think you can blame it on Hollywood. There is still
an economic argument; the Americans control our distribution
system. Distribution is how you fund production, so if Americans
control your distribution how are you ever going to fund production
except through a dribble of grants through the public sector. But
Canadians are not going to make films on the scale of Hollywood
unless we go to Hollywood.
The other thing standing in our way is the kind of films we
make. We're a very different kind of culture from the United States
or even Australia for that matter. We're not a larger than life
culture. We're not a heroic culture.
Consequently, we tend to make more introverted films and they
don't play well commercially. They can't be expected to. But some
of them are extremely interesting. The directors who have tried
hardest to stay true to their vision, and do not sell out to
something more commercial, in the end, they prevail.
People tend to think there is only one kind of success to movie
making. But you know if we applied the same standards to
literature, we'd be dead. When we look at literature we don't think
everything should be like Tom Clancy or Stephen King. Literature
that doesn't sell like that but is critically esteemed is
considered to have some shelf life and is considered more valuable
in the long run than another potboiler.
I think we have to be tolerant to art in filmmaking as well
because when filmmaking is that dominant in the culture, it's much
harder to find a place for movies that are quiet, interesting,
challenging, disturbing.
FESTIVAL DIRT
Chapters.ca: What was the lowest point of the
film festival?
Johnson: I think when Leonard Schein, and I
mean no disrespect to Leonard, took over the festival there was
basically a mutiny over his leadership. There was a really sense of
the festival expelling someone who was not of their culture. I
don't think it was just a matter a clique expelling someone who was
not cool; I think it's got a lot do with the kind of values that
are inherent in the festival community.
When I was writing this book I didn't really feel a
responsibility to the organization -- none at all, really. They
commissioned me to write the book and then I struck a deal that if
I wrote it, it would be completely independent; I would have
complete control over it. But I did feel a responsibility to the
festival community, because that's the core readership of the book
and they're not a corporation, they're a community.
Chapters.ca: So of all your time at the
festival what were some of the wildest moments?
Johnson: Well, I still remember the Beatty
tribute as being pretty exciting. Seeing Jack Nicholson and Warren
Beatty I thought was a real kick. Seeing
Nicholson and realizing what a huge star he was that all he had to
do was put on a pair of lime green sunglasses and the crowd went
wild. It was like watching a rock star.
The tributes inaugurated that Hollywood buzz around the festival
has never really left it. That was its coming of age. Some people
though that was the most exciting thing that could happen and
others thought it was the beginning of the end. Sex, drugs, rock
& roll and movie stars is a pretty potent combination.
It's funny, you know, I didn't write about myself in the book at
all except for when I talk about driving film. There was a thrill
of just driving a truck of celluloid around town, showing up at
theatres, flinging film canisters around like weights at a gym and
feeling really pumped, and going to parties. I had the hottest
commodity in town. I think the most fun I've had at the festival is
driving film.
Chapters.ca: What was best film you've ever
seen at the festival?
Johnson: Well, I can only think of the most
recent best film. But the most recent best film I've seen was
Beau Travail, which was the last film I saw in the 1999
festival. It hasn't been released yet and I don't think it
will.
It was such a strange and marvellous film, one of those ones you
hear a little bit of a buzz and then your eyes just pop out of your
head -- you can't believe what you're seeing. It was just pure
poetry. For me that's really exciting. There's nothing arid about
that. It's like sex -- it's just completely liquid on screen.
That's what you go to a festival to see. It's a bit like being a
junkie. You're looking for the really good stuff, the pure stuff --
not that I've ever been a junkie or know what it's like to be a
junkie -- but I think there's something very drug-like about the
experience. It's like being at a festival and sinking yourself into
the films -- you enter a dreamtime.
THE FUTURE...
Chapters.ca: So what's in store for the next 25
years of the festival?
Johnson: The festival has continued to grow
every year in the last little while. I can't see that continuing. I
hope that it doesn't continue. If it does, it'll be bigger than
Cannes, which will not be a pretty sight. At least in Cannes,
you're on the French Riviera, but something on the scale of Cannes
in Toronto sounds nightmarish to me.
I see the festival as a bit of a trust. Not in a financial
sense, but sort of a sacred trust. The people running it really
have a mandate to create a space for us to see the movies that we
don't get to see normally and that's the most important thing about
it. We just have to be very wary of letting it slip into the wrong
hands.
Chapters.ca: Who are your favourite
authors?
Johnson: It would sound pretentious -- Shakespeare. These days
I like Russell Banks, Michael Ondaatje. I'm in
love with Anne Carson. I used to
be a big Thomas Hardy fan when I
was a teenager. I always draw a blank when I'm asked that because
they're always so obvious. Fitzgerald. I like Ian McEwan a lot -- I
like that kind of writing. Spare, kind of dark, no words wasted. I
have trouble with big fat novels; I like shrewd, economical works
of fiction.
Chapters.ca: Are you reading anything now?
Johnson: No, I had a summer vacation where I
read a whole whack of books. I discovered Anne Carson and read all
of her works. Read some Russell Banks, read Experience by Martin Amis, which
annoyed me. But at the moment I'm too busy. I find at this time of
year I read magazines.